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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:24 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Hamilton wouldn't be able to keep an under performing driver at Mercedes much like he couldn't keep Heikki at McLaren, he got on well with him as well.

you know for a fact that Lewis can't do this at Mercedes whereas Vettel can do it at Ferrari? Where do you get your information?

I don't believe that Mercedes would retain an under performing driver like Kimi especially with Ocon waiting in the wings, I wouldn't say Bottas is under performing at the moment so it becomes somewhat mute.

Meanwhile Kimi has been under performing at Ferrari for the last 5 years and every year stories appear of Vettel canvassing Ferrari to keep him, it is what it is.

what stories canvassing Ferrari to keep Kimi? The ones where he says he wouldn't mind keeping Kimi as a team mate? How does that tie in with the ones where he says he wouldn't mind having Ricciardo as a team mate? Does that mean he's lobbying for Ricciardo to join? Or is it only lobbying when it suits?

I agree that Kimi is under-performing, although this year I'd say he's been better than before. But you're joining dots where there aren't any by saying that it's Vettel's influence keeping him there, while simultaneously claiming that Hamilton doesn't have the same level of influence at Mercedes. Facts for you are just inconveniences, aren't they?

Does it really matter what I bring forward it's just dismissed as paddock rumour like Marchionne threatening to sign someone like Ricciardo after Baku last year if Vettel can't keep calm and be the driver to lead the team, no it's just coincidence that Ferrari sign an under performing driver season after season, and then make Bottas who has only had one season with Mercedes as a like for like comparison with Kimi.

So far this season do you see Bottas as being in the same situation as Kimi and if Bottas gets retained that would because of the influence of Hamilton, in fact if Bottas didn't get retained that would be because he was too competitive for Hamilton, that has been mooted although jokingly so.


When did this happen? What I remember from last year is Marchionne saying that Vettel can stay at Ferrari as long as he wants.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:47 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Hamilton wouldn't be able to keep an under performing driver at Mercedes much like he couldn't keep Heikki at McLaren, he got on well with him as well.

you know for a fact that Lewis can't do this at Mercedes whereas Vettel can do it at Ferrari? Where do you get your information?

I don't believe that Mercedes would retain an under performing driver like Kimi especially with Ocon waiting in the wings, I wouldn't say Bottas is under performing at the moment so it becomes somewhat mute.

Meanwhile Kimi has been under performing at Ferrari for the last 5 years and every year stories appear of Vettel canvassing Ferrari to keep him, it is what it is.

what stories canvassing Ferrari to keep Kimi? The ones where he says he wouldn't mind keeping Kimi as a team mate? How does that tie in with the ones where he says he wouldn't mind having Ricciardo as a team mate? Does that mean he's lobbying for Ricciardo to join? Or is it only lobbying when it suits?

I agree that Kimi is under-performing, although this year I'd say he's been better than before. But you're joining dots where there aren't any by saying that it's Vettel's influence keeping him there, while simultaneously claiming that Hamilton doesn't have the same level of influence at Mercedes. Facts for you are just inconveniences, aren't they?

Does it really matter what I bring forward it's just dismissed as paddock rumour like Marchionne threatening to sign someone like Ricciardo after Baku last year if Vettel can't keep calm and be the driver to lead the team, no it's just coincidence that Ferrari sign an under performing driver season after season, and then make Bottas who has only had one season with Mercedes as a like for like comparison with Kimi.

So far this season do you see Bottas as being in the same situation as Kimi and if Bottas gets retained that would because of the influence of Hamilton, in fact if Bottas didn't get retained that would be because he was too competitive for Hamilton, that has been mooted although jokingly so.

I'm not the one claiming undue driver influence, so whether Bottas stays or goes I'm not claiming that it's because of Hamilton. I'm pointing out the absurdity of claiming that Vettel lobbied to keep Kimi and has great power in that area, while at the same time dismissing it when Hamilton says very similar things about Bottas and claiming Hamilton has no influence.

I personally believe that both teams would likely listen to what their top driver has to say and take their preferences into account, which is far removed from saying they have authority to make hiring decisions. I just think it tends to get overblown in Vettel's case by those with an agenda to try and make out he's somehow running scared.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:16 pm 
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Heard my favourite rumour so far, Newey and Alonso to Renault for next year.

God that would be good. Renault with their nose put out of joint and determined to succeed, ie money being released, Newey is Newey and knows what he knows, it wouldn't be an over night job but with their development already and Newey magic they could get close by the end of next year and the stated goal of competing in 2020 could then be more realistic. Alonso would jump at the chance to work with him.

Probably the only way I can see Alonso staying in F1 but he's got some hurdles like WEC commitments next year that Renault may not like.

Anyway I think Newey will ultimately stay with Red Bull but he refused to deny the Renault link and he is out of contract at the end of the year so I'd love to see it.

Or even better give him the keys to the kingdom at McLaren, Zak. Give him whatever job he wants, TD,Team Principle, Lord of Woking, it doesn't matter. Let him design a McLaren supercar called the McLaren Newey. Let him go to Indy or WEC teams with McLaren and Alonso to do what he wants and with a seat for his boy thrown in.

Whatever it takes.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:29 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
you know for a fact that Lewis can't do this at Mercedes whereas Vettel can do it at Ferrari? Where do you get your information?

I don't believe that Mercedes would retain an under performing driver like Kimi especially with Ocon waiting in the wings, I wouldn't say Bottas is under performing at the moment so it becomes somewhat mute.

Meanwhile Kimi has been under performing at Ferrari for the last 5 years and every year stories appear of Vettel canvassing Ferrari to keep him, it is what it is.

what stories canvassing Ferrari to keep Kimi? The ones where he says he wouldn't mind keeping Kimi as a team mate? How does that tie in with the ones where he says he wouldn't mind having Ricciardo as a team mate? Does that mean he's lobbying for Ricciardo to join? Or is it only lobbying when it suits?

I agree that Kimi is under-performing, although this year I'd say he's been better than before. But you're joining dots where there aren't any by saying that it's Vettel's influence keeping him there, while simultaneously claiming that Hamilton doesn't have the same level of influence at Mercedes. Facts for you are just inconveniences, aren't they?

Does it really matter what I bring forward it's just dismissed as paddock rumour like Marchionne threatening to sign someone like Ricciardo after Baku last year if Vettel can't keep calm and be the driver to lead the team, no it's just coincidence that Ferrari sign an under performing driver season after season, and then make Bottas who has only had one season with Mercedes as a like for like comparison with Kimi.

So far this season do you see Bottas as being in the same situation as Kimi and if Bottas gets retained that would because of the influence of Hamilton, in fact if Bottas didn't get retained that would be because he was too competitive for Hamilton, that has been mooted although jokingly so.


When did this happen? What I remember from last year is Marchionne saying that Vettel can stay at Ferrari as long as he wants.

That would be to sign Ricciardo alongside Vettel.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:33 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
you know for a fact that Lewis can't do this at Mercedes whereas Vettel can do it at Ferrari? Where do you get your information?

I don't believe that Mercedes would retain an under performing driver like Kimi especially with Ocon waiting in the wings, I wouldn't say Bottas is under performing at the moment so it becomes somewhat mute.

Meanwhile Kimi has been under performing at Ferrari for the last 5 years and every year stories appear of Vettel canvassing Ferrari to keep him, it is what it is.

what stories canvassing Ferrari to keep Kimi? The ones where he says he wouldn't mind keeping Kimi as a team mate? How does that tie in with the ones where he says he wouldn't mind having Ricciardo as a team mate? Does that mean he's lobbying for Ricciardo to join? Or is it only lobbying when it suits?

I agree that Kimi is under-performing, although this year I'd say he's been better than before. But you're joining dots where there aren't any by saying that it's Vettel's influence keeping him there, while simultaneously claiming that Hamilton doesn't have the same level of influence at Mercedes. Facts for you are just inconveniences, aren't they?

Does it really matter what I bring forward it's just dismissed as paddock rumour like Marchionne threatening to sign someone like Ricciardo after Baku last year if Vettel can't keep calm and be the driver to lead the team, no it's just coincidence that Ferrari sign an under performing driver season after season, and then make Bottas who has only had one season with Mercedes as a like for like comparison with Kimi.

So far this season do you see Bottas as being in the same situation as Kimi and if Bottas gets retained that would because of the influence of Hamilton, in fact if Bottas didn't get retained that would be because he was too competitive for Hamilton, that has been mooted although jokingly so.

I'm not the one claiming undue driver influence, so whether Bottas stays or goes I'm not claiming that it's because of Hamilton. I'm pointing out the absurdity of claiming that Vettel lobbied to keep Kimi and has great power in that area, while at the same time dismissing it when Hamilton says very similar things about Bottas and claiming Hamilton has no influence.

I personally believe that both teams would likely listen to what their top driver has to say and take their preferences into account, which is far removed from saying they have authority to make hiring decisions. I just think it tends to get overblown in Vettel's case by those with an agenda to try and make out he's somehow running scared.

Proof is in the pudding when an under performing driver gets signed season after season, when Bottas gets retained under the same circumstances then you may have a case.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:37 pm 
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Lotus49 wrote:
Heard my favourite rumour so far, Newey and Alonso to Renault for next year.

God that would be good. Renault with their nose put out of joint and determined to succeed, ie money being released, Newey is Newey and knows what he knows, it wouldn't be an over night job but with their development already and Newey magic they could get close by the end of next year and the stated goal of competing in 2020 could then be more realistic. Alonso would jump at the chance to work with him.

Probably the only way I can see Alonso staying in F1 but he's got some hurdles like WEC commitments next year that Renault may not like.

Anyway I think Newey will ultimately stay with Red Bull but he refused to deny the Renault link and he is out of contract at the end of the year so I'd love to see it.

Or even better give him the keys to the kingdom at McLaren, Zak. Give him whatever job he wants, TD,Team Principle, Lord of Woking, it doesn't matter. Let him design a McLaren supercar called the McLaren Newey. Let him go to Indy or WEC teams with McLaren and Alonso to do what he wants and with a seat for his boy thrown in.

Whatever it takes.

Nice rumour but I can't see it happening, also if it did happen Alonso would have to can all these extra commitments, after all he's only doing these because he doesn't have a winning F1 car.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:41 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:
Heard my favourite rumour so far, Newey and Alonso to Renault for next year.

God that would be good. Renault with their nose put out of joint and determined to succeed, ie money being released, Newey is Newey and knows what he knows, it wouldn't be an over night job but with their development already and Newey magic they could get close by the end of next year and the stated goal of competing in 2020 could then be more realistic. Alonso would jump at the chance to work with him.

Probably the only way I can see Alonso staying in F1 but he's got some hurdles like WEC commitments next year that Renault may not like.

Anyway I think Newey will ultimately stay with Red Bull but he refused to deny the Renault link and he is out of contract at the end of the year so I'd love to see it.

Or even better give him the keys to the kingdom at McLaren, Zak. Give him whatever job he wants, TD,Team Principle, Lord of Woking, it doesn't matter. Let him design a McLaren supercar called the McLaren Newey. Let him go to Indy or WEC teams with McLaren and Alonso to do what he wants and with a seat for his boy thrown in.

Whatever it takes.

Nice rumour but I can't see it happening, also if it did happen Alonso would have to can all these extra commitments, after all he's only doing these because he doesn't have a winning F1 car.


Me neither unfortunately. He may have had to, I can see why Renault might object.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:35 am 
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Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:22 am 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:29 am 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

I can't see this for Daniel. Why take the chance? There is no reason to leave Red Bull for Mclaren. Even if you don't have faith in the Honda engine, you saw the difference between the chassis of the two teams' cars this year with identical engines and there is a massive gulf between them. I can't see Daniel deciding to do this and to line up with yet another young phenom who the press and the team will be eager to prop up above him at the first sign of promise.

I think the only teams that should make him consider leaving are works teams.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:37 am 
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:D :D Love this thread. Beats the actual racing by miles.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:12 am 
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Huge $20 million McLaren offer for Daniel Ricciardo to leave Red Bull: report - 9Wide World of Sports

https://wwos.nine.com.au/2018/06/21/11/ ... do-reports

I wonder how much validity there is to this report.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:35 am 
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Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:26 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.


Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:33 am 
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Good that McLaren are offering $20m. Ricciardo can bargain a bit harder for a pay hike as well. McLaren is only an attraction to Norris. Ricciardo wants to win a title & Red Bull are more likely to deliver a car for that when compared to McLaren.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:38 am 
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I'd be amazed if he went to McLaren, no matter the offer. At least when Alonso went there, there seemed to be some good reasons to give it a go. Now McLaren are very much just a customer team with a reportedly outdated infrastructure.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:49 am 
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Mclaren will either fold or be sold in 3-4 years at most. Big name gone wrong path. Ricciardo has no business going there.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:54 am 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Good that McLaren are offering $20m. Ricciardo can bargain a bit harder for a pay hike as well. McLaren is only an attraction to Norris. Ricciardo wants to win a title & Red Bull are more likely to deliver a car for that when compared to McLaren.


Looking at Macca's form and taking into account what Ricciardo has said, I doubt this would enhance his negotiation position at all.

I don't think anyone would think he'd give the offer even the slightest consideration so I reckon, if indeed it's a real offer, it'll have absolutely no impact on his market value.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 9:01 am 
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Ricciardo to McLaren. As others have said, it's unlikely. But there's a but. A small one, but a but nonetheless.

What if they've quietly revealed some plans... be it personnel or, perhaps, a drivetrain plan for the 2012 onwards era? Plans that indicate a decent possibility that the current apparent incompetence of McLaren can realistically end. What if they are offering to build the team around him? What if there's a get-out possibility in the event that Hamilton quits and Merc are interested?

All that said, I'd be most surprised were he to go with McLaren.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 9:06 am 
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Right now, is not the time to go to Mclaren.

They need to get their issues sorted out. It's been an interesting last 2 races: RBR have really jumped in to the fold. Ferrari are ahead again. 2 races where Merc have struggled.

The best of the rest seems to be changing every race. You got a few drivers not performing or making crucial mistakes. Some teams hitting the back field and going no where. Mclaren are very inconsistent at the moment. They went to scoring well to... well.. struggling.

I think Ric will want a single season contract at RBR unless Ferrari kick out Kimi which might happen.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:05 am 
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Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.


Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.


My feeling is this is more down to the individual situations at Mercedes and Ferrari than it is a reflection of the opinion/interest of those two teams in Ricciardo. I suspect both have had some sort of discussion with Ricciardo's management team because you never know what'll happen, but as things stand Mercedes seem happy to keep Hamilton and Bottas (especially as the latter has been close enough to Hamilton to quieten a lot of the speculation about potentially being replaced for 2019) and Ferrari seem willing to retain the Vettel/Raikkonen partnership for another year. So there is no real need for them to aggressively, publicly pursue Ricciardo when it seems like neither is strongly considering a change of driver anyway. And even if either was looking at dropping a Finn, there is a French-speaking youngster who they might choose to promote rather than going out and signing Ricciardo.

As for Ricciardo not re-signing at Red Bull before now, my guess would be it is largely down to wanting to know what route they're going with the engine supplier. I'm sure he's had dialogue with Red Bull's management in the build-up to Canada to get an indication of what their thinking was, but it sounds like Red Bull themselves were waiting to see the relative performance of the upgrades in Canada before committing to one or the other. I would imagine Ricciardo knew about the decision last week before it became public knowledge, but until that point I can't imagine he was going to make a decision regardless of what other interest there was.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:24 am 
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Lt. Drebin wrote:
Mclaren will either fold or be sold in 3-4 years at most. Big name gone wrong path. Ricciardo has no business going there.


Are you talking about McLaren Technology Group, composed of McLaren Racing, McLaren Automotive, and McLaren Applied Technologies, with over 5,000 employees and revenue in excess of 500 million dollars?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:25 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.


Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.


My feeling is this is more down to the individual situations at Mercedes and Ferrari than it is a reflection of the opinion/interest of those two teams in Ricciardo. I suspect both have had some sort of discussion with Ricciardo's management team because you never know what'll happen, but as things stand Mercedes seem happy to keep Hamilton and Bottas (especially as the latter has been close enough to Hamilton to quieten a lot of the speculation about potentially being replaced for 2019) and Ferrari seem willing to retain the Vettel/Raikkonen partnership for another year. So there is no real need for them to aggressively, publicly pursue Ricciardo when it seems like neither is strongly considering a change of driver anyway. And even if either was looking at dropping a Finn, there is a French-speaking youngster who they might choose to promote rather than going out and signing Ricciardo.

As for Ricciardo not re-signing at Red Bull before now, my guess would be it is largely down to wanting to know what route they're going with the engine supplier. I'm sure he's had dialogue with Red Bull's management in the build-up to Canada to get an indication of what their thinking was, but it sounds like Red Bull themselves were waiting to see the relative performance of the upgrades in Canada before committing to one or the other. I would imagine Ricciardo knew about the decision last week before it became public knowledge, but until that point I can't imagine he was going to make a decision regardless of what other interest there was.


True. He probably was waiting for the decision. Can't say though if he wanted Red Bull to stick with Renault or choose Honda. I'm sure Red Bull's decision to partner with Honda will be a big factor in his decision.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:31 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.


Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.


My feeling is this is more down to the individual situations at Mercedes and Ferrari than it is a reflection of the opinion/interest of those two teams in Ricciardo. I suspect both have had some sort of discussion with Ricciardo's management team because you never know what'll happen, but as things stand Mercedes seem happy to keep Hamilton and Bottas (especially as the latter has been close enough to Hamilton to quieten a lot of the speculation about potentially being replaced for 2019) and Ferrari seem willing to retain the Vettel/Raikkonen partnership for another year. So there is no real need for them to aggressively, publicly pursue Ricciardo when it seems like neither is strongly considering a change of driver anyway. And even if either was looking at dropping a Finn, there is a French-speaking youngster who they might choose to promote rather than going out and signing Ricciardo.

As for Ricciardo not re-signing at Red Bull before now, my guess would be it is largely down to wanting to know what route they're going with the engine supplier. I'm sure he's had dialogue with Red Bull's management in the build-up to Canada to get an indication of what their thinking was, but it sounds like Red Bull themselves were waiting to see the relative performance of the upgrades in Canada before committing to one or the other. I would imagine Ricciardo knew about the decision last week before it became public knowledge, but until that point I can't imagine he was going to make a decision regardless of what other interest there was.


You might be right JU and my tin foil hat's on a little tight tonight but my question is if that Merc & Ferrari have said thanks but no thanks, and the only offer he has is for RB, what's the point in dragging out re-signing until their engine situation's sorted?

What was he going to do either way RB went? Why wait to sign when there is only 1 door open and the rest have been firmly shut?

But then again I could be adding 2 + 2 and coming up with 6

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:40 am 
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Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Lt. Drebin wrote:
Mclaren will either fold or be sold in 3-4 years at most. Big name gone wrong path. Ricciardo has no business going there.


Are you talking about McLaren Technology Group, composed of McLaren Racing, McLaren Automotive, and McLaren Applied Technologies, with over 5,000 employees and revenue in excess of 500 million dollars?

They won't fold. They are too diverse now and have a strong base. But I do have a concern that in abandoning the Honda works deal they have relegated themselves to F1 also-rans. They are a shadow of their former selves, sadly.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:07 am 
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Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.


My feeling is this is more down to the individual situations at Mercedes and Ferrari than it is a reflection of the opinion/interest of those two teams in Ricciardo. I suspect both have had some sort of discussion with Ricciardo's management team because you never know what'll happen, but as things stand Mercedes seem happy to keep Hamilton and Bottas (especially as the latter has been close enough to Hamilton to quieten a lot of the speculation about potentially being replaced for 2019) and Ferrari seem willing to retain the Vettel/Raikkonen partnership for another year. So there is no real need for them to aggressively, publicly pursue Ricciardo when it seems like neither is strongly considering a change of driver anyway. And even if either was looking at dropping a Finn, there is a French-speaking youngster who they might choose to promote rather than going out and signing Ricciardo.

As for Ricciardo not re-signing at Red Bull before now, my guess would be it is largely down to wanting to know what route they're going with the engine supplier. I'm sure he's had dialogue with Red Bull's management in the build-up to Canada to get an indication of what their thinking was, but it sounds like Red Bull themselves were waiting to see the relative performance of the upgrades in Canada before committing to one or the other. I would imagine Ricciardo knew about the decision last week before it became public knowledge, but until that point I can't imagine he was going to make a decision regardless of what other interest there was.


You might be right JU and my tin foil hat's on a little tight tonight but my question is if that Merc & Ferrari have said thanks but no thanks, and the only offer he has is for RB, what's the point in dragging out re-signing until their engine situation's sorted?

What was he going to do either way RB went? Why wait to sign when there is only 1 door open and the rest have been firmly shut?

But then again I could be adding 2 + 2 and coming up with 6


It's a fair point, but it does hinge on the idea that both Mercedes and Ferrari have definitively told him they're not interested. At this stage in the season I'd be very surprised if that were the case for both of them when neither has confirmed their line-up for 2019.

Also, we have no idea what Ricciardo's opinion of Honda is. It could be that his view aligns with Red Bull's and that he considers them a better option going forward, which only enhances the chance he'll remain where he is. It could also be the opposite and by ditching Renault engines, Red Bull actually make the prospect of staying less appealing to Daniel.

Ultimately, Daniel's taking a leap of faith whatever he does now. He's going to have to take a decision a long while in advance of knowing how the Honda/Renault engines will compare in 2019 so whatever he does, he could end up making the wrong choice. I'd argue his best choice might be signing a two/three year extension with Red Bull, but insisting on an out-clause like Vettel had related to Red Bull's position in the WCC next year. That way if Honda go backwards and Red Bull find themselves 4th or lower in the WCC, Ricciardo can escape, and if Honda continue to improve he's at the right team.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:16 am 
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I think we can all agree that McLaren F1 (Not Group) are going the same way as Williams...

Only thing that's slowing down that process is the immense amount of money they have compared to Williams.


I've always felt (and is kinda proven on Glassdoor) that their egos have let themselves down. Unfortunately, they believe that being apart of McLaren is enough for them to get out of this mess.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:28 am 
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If true what does that say of McLaren's incumbent drivers given that surely Norris will be in the team next year?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:35 am 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

This soon went from all the doors are closed for Ricciardo to a bidding war between 4 teams. :?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:36 am 
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Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.

Yeah I ventured that as well in another thread.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:36 am 
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pokerman wrote:
If true what does that say of McLaren's incumbent drivers given that surely Norris will be in the team next year?

The assumption is that Norris will be in the team next year, but we don't know that for sure.

I should imagine McLaren are doing what every team does: covering their bases. Ricciardo is a proven F1 talent, whereas Norris isn't. I'm sure that if they had to make a choice they'd rather go for the former.

Or it could mean they are disappointed with Vandoorne and feel he's not quite the driver they were looking for. Or that Alonso might be leaving the team, possibly to do WEC or Indy. Point is I think it's way too early to form conclusions yet


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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:54 am 
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sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

I can't see this for Daniel. Why take the chance? There is no reason to leave Red Bull for Mclaren. Even if you don't have faith in the Honda engine, you saw the difference between the chassis of the two teams' cars this year with identical engines and there is a massive gulf between them. I can't see Daniel deciding to do this and to line up with yet another young phenom who the press and the team will be eager to prop up above him at the first sign of promise.

I think the only teams that should make him consider leaving are works teams.

The main attraction for Ricciardo would be the money, with Verstappen on $10M that puts a ceiling on what Red Bull can offer Ricciardo so $20M is very much double the money. That sort of money is easy for someone like Alonso to walk away from who has plenty of money already, but is a lot for someone presently on $6M.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:57 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.

How would it be not true though that if Ricciardo did sign for McLaren then Vandoorne would be gone.

The actual merry go round would then see Sainz at Red Bull and Vandoorne at Renault.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:59 am 
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Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
If true what does that say of McLaren's incumbent drivers given that surely Norris will be in the team next year?

The assumption is that Norris will be in the team next year, but we don't know that for sure.


I don't think we should even assume that. Not long ago someone from team management indicated the situation wasn't that easy and that the amount of control they had over other teams was limited - so from that it followed that they were mainly looking to get hem in another team.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:00 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Good that McLaren are offering $20m. Ricciardo can bargain a bit harder for a pay hike as well. McLaren is only an attraction to Norris. Ricciardo wants to win a title & Red Bull are more likely to deliver a car for that when compared to McLaren.

Verstappen is on $10M, do you see Red Bull offering Ricciardo more than that?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:01 pm 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.


My feeling is this is more down to the individual situations at Mercedes and Ferrari than it is a reflection of the opinion/interest of those two teams in Ricciardo. I suspect both have had some sort of discussion with Ricciardo's management team because you never know what'll happen, but as things stand Mercedes seem happy to keep Hamilton and Bottas (especially as the latter has been close enough to Hamilton to quieten a lot of the speculation about potentially being replaced for 2019) and Ferrari seem willing to retain the Vettel/Raikkonen partnership for another year. So there is no real need for them to aggressively, publicly pursue Ricciardo when it seems like neither is strongly considering a change of driver anyway. And even if either was looking at dropping a Finn, there is a French-speaking youngster who they might choose to promote rather than going out and signing Ricciardo.

As for Ricciardo not re-signing at Red Bull before now, my guess would be it is largely down to wanting to know what route they're going with the engine supplier. I'm sure he's had dialogue with Red Bull's management in the build-up to Canada to get an indication of what their thinking was, but it sounds like Red Bull themselves were waiting to see the relative performance of the upgrades in Canada before committing to one or the other. I would imagine Ricciardo knew about the decision last week before it became public knowledge, but until that point I can't imagine he was going to make a decision regardless of what other interest there was.


You might be right JU and my tin foil hat's on a little tight tonight but my question is if that Merc & Ferrari have said thanks but no thanks, and the only offer he has is for RB, what's the point in dragging out re-signing until their engine situation's sorted?

What was he going to do either way RB went? Why wait to sign when there is only 1 door open and the rest have been firmly shut?

But then again I could be adding 2 + 2 and coming up with 6


It's a fair point, but it does hinge on the idea that both Mercedes and Ferrari have definitively told him they're not interested. At this stage in the season I'd be very surprised if that were the case for both of them when neither has confirmed their line-up for 2019.


This leads back to my first point that it would seem that at least one other team is showing at least some interest, for one reason or another, in signing him

Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Also, we have no idea what Ricciardo's opinion of Honda is. It could be that his view aligns with Red Bull's and that he considers them a better option going forward, which only enhances the chance he'll remain where he is. It could also be the opposite and by ditching Renault engines, Red Bull actually make the prospect of staying less appealing to Daniel.


Maybe but again, if RB have the only offer on the table, no matter what his thoughts are his choice would be to stay with RB or leave F1 altogether and lets face it, if RB know their offer is the only one Dan has, and they already have Verstappen locked away and have Sainz available if Ricciardo leaves, it doesn't exactly leave him in a position of strength.

Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Ultimately, Daniel's taking a leap of faith whatever he does now. He's going to have to take a decision a long while in advance of knowing how the Honda/Renault engines will compare in 2019 so whatever he does, he could end up making the wrong choice. I'd argue his best choice might be signing a two/three year extension with Red Bull, but insisting on an out-clause like Vettel had related to Red Bull's position in the WCC next year. That way if Honda go backwards and Red Bull find themselves 4th or lower in the WCC, Ricciardo can escape, and if Honda continue to improve he's at the right team.


I'd suggest that if RB are his only choice he may not be in a position to dictate terms of that magnitude..

My belief is Merc is definitely a no go. That door is firmly shut.

Ferrari still a slim possibility and if he can wrangle a contract at joint #1 with Vettel, go for it.

If he can get #1 status at Renault, that'd be next best after Ferrari and maybe even a better long term option.

Staying at RB Honda would be the go if the 3 options above were not available.

The more I think about it though the more appealing #1 at Renault seems to me if that's an option for him.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:05 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Why on earth would Ricciardo go to McLaren, a team who are the slowest of the three Renault-powered teams (despite having the best driver of the lot) when he has said if he leaves Red Bull it will be in pursuit of a shot at the WDC? McLaren have shown zero ability to provide such an opportunity for their drivers for over half a decade and right now, the only thing they've got going for them is the history behind the team.

Right now if he's going to leave Red Bull but stay with a Renault-powered team then Renault are by far and away the better choice, and even then he's still hoping that a) their progress continues and b) Honda's progress falters.

Exediron wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Supposedly, McLaren have offered a multi year deal to Ricciardo where he'll get $20 million per year.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/motorsport/formula-one/daniel-ricciardo-reportedly-offered-20m-per-season-deal/news-story/ef50e9b977d2252a807decb4f756211c

If true, that has to mean they're looking to get rid of Vandoorne. Even if Alonso leaves, they're adamant that they're going to give Norris a seat: a multi-year deal could only be filling Vandoorne's slot.

Mind you, that first 'if' is a big one. We're well and truly into Silly Season now.


BIB: I actually disagree. I think Alonso is as good as gone, if not from F1 then certainly from McLaren, and Ricciardo simply represents the best available driver to replace him. So it's logical they would have some interest in him regardless of the likelihood that they can actually attract him. Realistically, they won't, and they'll end up replacing Alonso from within (Norris) and keeping Vandoorne.

How would it be not true though that if Ricciardo did sign for McLaren then Vandoorne would be gone.

The actual merry go round would then see Sainz at Red Bull and Vandoorne at Renault.


I only see them signing Ricciardo if Alonso leaves, freeing up a lot of budget to spend on Ricciardo.

I also somehow think that Alonso has made up his mind about leaving and has informed McLaren already.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:06 pm 
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Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Agree with all this.

Macca offers nothing beneficial to Ricciardo. He's on record as saying he's after a championship and not a pay day and if he goes to macca then he might as well say goodbye to any chance of a WC for good.

Agree about Alonso as well. I think he's as good as gone.

Maybe it's just me but i'm finding this Ricciardo contract thing a tad strange.

As it stands now he has a total of one confirmed offer on the table and that's stay at RB. Neither Merc, Ferrari or Renault (I include Renault as they're a works team and I think it's obvious that if he goes there it'd be as #1 driver). has publicly confirmed or denied having interest in Ricciardo.

You'd think his management team would certainly have had some discussions with rival teams at the minimum just to get an idea of where they're at and the fact that he hasn't re-signed for RB tells me there is interest, be it genuine or otherwise, from at least 1 of those 3 teams.

Now it might be just Merc using him a leverage in their negotiations with Hamilton or it could be Ferrari doing a bit of manoeuvring to open the gates for him to go there but to me its strange that the rumour mill around what he's doing has been incredibly, and unusually quite.


My feeling is this is more down to the individual situations at Mercedes and Ferrari than it is a reflection of the opinion/interest of those two teams in Ricciardo. I suspect both have had some sort of discussion with Ricciardo's management team because you never know what'll happen, but as things stand Mercedes seem happy to keep Hamilton and Bottas (especially as the latter has been close enough to Hamilton to quieten a lot of the speculation about potentially being replaced for 2019) and Ferrari seem willing to retain the Vettel/Raikkonen partnership for another year. So there is no real need for them to aggressively, publicly pursue Ricciardo when it seems like neither is strongly considering a change of driver anyway. And even if either was looking at dropping a Finn, there is a French-speaking youngster who they might choose to promote rather than going out and signing Ricciardo.

As for Ricciardo not re-signing at Red Bull before now, my guess would be it is largely down to wanting to know what route they're going with the engine supplier. I'm sure he's had dialogue with Red Bull's management in the build-up to Canada to get an indication of what their thinking was, but it sounds like Red Bull themselves were waiting to see the relative performance of the upgrades in Canada before committing to one or the other. I would imagine Ricciardo knew about the decision last week before it became public knowledge, but until that point I can't imagine he was going to make a decision regardless of what other interest there was.


You might be right JU and my tin foil hat's on a little tight tonight but my question is if that Merc & Ferrari have said thanks but no thanks, and the only offer he has is for RB, what's the point in dragging out re-signing until their engine situation's sorted?

What was he going to do either way RB went? Why wait to sign when there is only 1 door open and the rest have been firmly shut?

But then again I could be adding 2 + 2 and coming up with 6


It's a fair point, but it does hinge on the idea that both Mercedes and Ferrari have definitively told him they're not interested. At this stage in the season I'd be very surprised if that were the case for both of them when neither has confirmed their line-up for 2019.


This leads back to my first point that it would seem that at least one other team is showing at least some interest, for one reason or another, in signing him


Hamilton is yet to sign, yes? So it makes sense that Mercedes would like to have options, and in that regard talks with Ricciardo seem logical.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:21 pm 
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mds wrote:

Hamilton is yet to sign, yes? So it makes sense that Mercedes would like to have options, and in that regard talks with Ricciardo seem logical.


Both seem comfortable they'll be together next year and the delay is just to allow them to focus on the Ferrari threat

http://www.espn.com.au/f1/story/_/id/23508321/mercedes-explains-delay-lewis-hamilton-contract-talks

And again, what option does Hamilton have if he wants to stay in F1? No chance Ferrari or RB. So what are his options?

He's in a similar, albeit a slightly stronger boat, as Ricciardo. Hamilton's not going anywhere next year and both him & Merc know it.

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Last edited by Jezza13 on Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly Season 2019
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:23 pm 
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I've just merged the other Ricciardo/Mclaren discussion into this topic - apologies if that has caused any confusion!


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